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Deparko

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Posts: 99
Reply with quote  #1 
Hi Ted Greene Family,

First off, hope everyone is healthy and doing well. I continue to try and make the most of a bad situation by practicing my guitar and trying to update my music making. I am spending a lot of time in the "Bass Enhanced Triads" area. Mainly just playing the sounds and trying to use them functionally in my playing. I'm looking at this sheet:

http://tedgreene.com/images/lessons/chords/MajorTriadPolychords-Type1_1977-07-17_1978-07-23.pdf

and wonder if someone can enlighten me or point me to some more reference material on this page. Particularly what are "Type 1" polychords. Are there other types? if so, what are the characteristics? Examples? 

also looking at page 2. Ted talks about melody harmonization and provides specific groups of chords per key. Really curious on why those chords are grouped that way. First example: Key of C, Ted has bII, bVII, iV (major 9ths) grouped together. Anyone know what the relationships of the groups to the key is. 

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.  Thank God for TedGreene.com. It's certainly helping me maintain my mental health and improve my guitar playing at the same time. Life is good!

Mark
PaulV

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Posts: 1,773
Reply with quote  #2 
Hi Mark,
Glad to hear that you're digging into Ted's lessons.  There's just so much that Ted has to offer, and I'm always excited about writing up new lessons for the coming months. I wish I had more time to really go deeper and apply more!  But it excites me to know that others are benefiting from these wonderful gems!

I don't think we'll ever know what "Type 1" means or what the other types are. But one guess would be that Type 2 would be dissonant in nature, since Type 1 is consonant. 

For page 2 here is how I believe Ted was thinking: 
Let's look at the first one on the list of melody notes to be harmonized. 
It's for the key of C, and the the melody note is C. 
For each chord Ted wants us to voice it so that the C is the soprano tone.

The first group are major 9 chords:
  • The Dbmaj9 chord with the C on top:  R, 9, 5, 7  (think of this as an Ab triad with Db in the bass. It would be more correct to call this a Dbmaj9 no3)
  • The Bbmaj9 chord with C on top:  R, 5, 7, 9  (think of this as a F triad with Bb in the bass.  It would be more correct to call this a Bbmaj9 no3)
  • The Fmaj9 chord with C on top:  R, 7, 9, 5   (think of this as a C triad with F in the bass. More correctly called Fmaj9 no 3)
The next group are add9 or 11th chords:
  • Ab/9 with C on top:  9, 5, R, 3 (think of this as an Ab triad with Bb [9th] in the bass)
  • F/9 with C on top:  9, R, 3, 5 (think of this as F triad with G [9th] in the bass) 
  • C/9 with C on top:  9, 3, 5, R  (think of this as C triad with D [9th] in the bass)
  • Bb11 with C on top:  R, b7, 9  (think of this as Ab triad with Bb in the bass) - this corresponds to the Ab/9 voicing above
  • G11 with C on top:  R, b7, 9, 11 (think of this as F triad with G in the bass) - this corresponds to the F/9 voicing above
  • D11 with C on top:  R, 9, 11, b7 (think of this as C triad with D in the bass) - this corresponds to the C/9 voicing above
The next group are 6/9#11 or dominant 7 chords.
  • F#6/9#11 (Ab7) - R, 6, 9, #11 - see this as a G# triad with F# in the bass (no 3rd in this 6/9#11 chord)
  • Eb6/9#11 (F7) - R, 9, #11, 6 - see this as a F triad with Eb in the bass (no 3rd in this 6/9#11 chord)
  • Bb6/9#11 (C7) - R, #11, 6, 9 -  see this as a C triad with Bb in the bass (no 3rd in this 6/9#11 chord)
The last group are simply major triads in second inversion

Why Ted didn't include other chord in each of these groups? For the first group of major 7 types he could have added Abmaj7 (3rd on top is C).  But since he used Ab in the add9 group, he might have thought it was a bit redundant to put it in the major 7 type group also. 

The notes that are used for the soprano tone are taken from the C major scale, and also notes from the parallel minor scale (C minor).   So he was thinking of an expanded key.  That's why you'll find Eb and E, for example, as melody notes for harmonizing.

Make sense?

__________________
--Paul
kontiki

Registered:
Posts: 267
Reply with quote  #3 
Paul, I think i understand why he didn't use Abmaj7. No chords on that page have a 3rd from the "Bass" (hence the polychord or bass enhaced triad aspect), and that's why he didn't choose Abmaj7( or maj9) for the melody note C. C is the third of the bass note and would therefore kill the "polychord concept and sound". the Abadd9 (Bb11)in the second section still sounds like a polychord because there is no 3rd from the "bass". having no 3rd from the bass make them sound like "bass enhanced triads" or "polychords". that's also why the simple triads are all in second inversion.

as for other pages, i think you're right. It would most likely have altered sounds, as well as minor interpretations of the chords on page 1

a good indicator and example of how Ted applied these sounds can be found in his comping sheet for bluesette. the chords not found on page 1 are used mainly as altered 7th type chords.

http://tedgreene.com/images/lessons/comping/Bluesette_TedGreeneCompingWithBET_KeyOfBb_1993-12-31.pdf

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Dmolished = Egads
Deparko

Registered:
Posts: 99
Reply with quote  #4 
Excellent! thanks Paul and Kontiki. I shall proceed
PaulV

Moderator
Registered:
Posts: 1,773
Reply with quote  #5 
I modified the voicings in my previous post. 
They were changed so as to show a voicing of a triad with a different bass note, thus the "polychord" or bass-enhanced triad aspect that Mike (kontiki) mentioned.
Sorry if I confused the matter.  I think it is clear now.

__________________
--Paul
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